<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #1561</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	12/23/99 3:12:17 AM Pacific Standard Time<BR>
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Traveller-digest    Thursday, December 23 1999    Volume 1999 : Number 1561<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: 3I Sports<BR>
Re: 3I Sports<BR>
Re: Traveller roadshows<BR>
Re: Terra and the US in IY 1110<BR>
Re: 3I Sports<BR>
Re: Traveller roadshows<BR>
RE: An illustrated Traveller universe<BR>
RE: Sac'to? (Was Re: SF Trav game)<BR>
RE: England<BR>
Re: FGMP<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #1555<BR>
Vargr gait (was Re: In Jokes)<BR>
Re: China (was: United States)<BR>
RE: England<BR>
Re Subsidies<BR>
Re: England<BR>
Re: England<BR>
Re: USIP<BR>
Re: Traveller roadshows<BR>
Re: England<BR>
Re: FGMP<BR>
Re: United States<BR>
Re: TNE Errata (was Re: In Jokes)<BR>
Re: Drawing Program<BR>
Re: Drawing Program<BR>
Re: Drawing Program<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 03:38:02 -0500<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: Re: 3I Sports<BR>
<BR>
From: Jim & Peta Lawrie <jimpeta@primus.com.au><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>     The book the script was lifted from was very good, it's called<BR>
> "Killerbowl" and it's Gridiron in hi-tech plastic armour and bloody big<BR>
> knives. The players live in a society where skill is emphasised and<BR>
>the fans only want blood, so the networks arrange it so the fans get<BR>
>what they want. I personally think it was the first ever cyberpunk<BR>
>book.<BR>
<BR>
I wouldn't go that so far as to call it the first cyberpunk book, but that's<BR>
just 'cause cyberpunk is / was a movement, and a select few people were<BR>
involved with it. The punk in cyberpunk means more than a dark future and<BR>
funny hair... don't tell that to R. Talsorian games, though. At the core of<BR>
the genre are a few things: the "do it yourself" punk ethos (Cheap Truth,<BR>
the *seminal* Movement 'zine was run off on a photo-copier) and the advent<BR>
of the cheap and non-archaic personal computer.<BR>
<BR>
Sci-fi has a long tradition of "dark future" books, The Time Machine, 1984,<BR>
Brave New World, A Clockwork Orange. There's more to it than that, however.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 03:40:37 -0500<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: Re: 3I Sports<BR>
<BR>
From: <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Okay, I'm weird, but I liked "The Gumball Rally" better than "Death<BR>
>Race 2000" and the "Magnificent Men..." movies even more than<BR>
>that. So sue me, but I like comedy.<BR>
<BR>
Well, I wasn't making any quality judgements.<BR>
<BR>
On the other hand, I find it difficult to classify Death Race 2000 as<BR>
anything but a comedy.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 08:47:19 GMT<BR>
From: "i Steve" <isteve1967@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller roadshows<BR>
<BR>
>Only  a   *Saint*  around here we used to say "God is alive and well >and <BR>
>playing Cricket for Yorkshire"<BR>
<BR>
Sounds like I'll be bumping into you at Headingley this season, the season <BR>
where we fulfil our promise and win everything, up to and including the <BR>
Nobel Peace Prize....assuming Darren Gough doesn't have a note from his mum <BR>
again!<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: This isn't even slightly relevant to Traveller.  I'm sorry.  I have <BR>
no excuse.<BR>
<BR>
iSteve<BR>
______________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 00:51:16 -0800<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Terra and the US in IY 1110<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Mike Linsenmayer" <mlinsenmayer@symantec.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: Terra and the US in IY 1110 (was various)<BR>
...<BR>
>Actually I think the Indians the Chinese, If they can get their economies in<BR>
>better shape will rule space, just becouse of shear numbers.<BR>
<BR>
  Luckily it takes high technology and wealth to build a space program, <BR>
which pretty much means that an industrialized country will win any<BR>
space race; perhaps more accurately, anyone that can pay should finish,<BR>
but that's really only easy for big G-7 countries or groups.<BR>
<BR>
        Steven Hudson<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 02:47:57 -0600<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: 3I Sports<BR>
<BR>
On 12/23/99 at 03:40 AM,  "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net> said:<BR>
<BR>
>From: <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>> Okay, I'm weird, but I liked "The Gumball Rally" better than "Death<BR>
>>Race 2000" and the "Magnificent Men..." movies even more than<BR>
>>that. So sue me, but I like comedy.<BR>
<BR>
>Well, I wasn't making any quality judgements.<BR>
<BR>
>On the other hand, I find it difficult to classify Death Race 2000 as<BR>
>anything but a comedy.<BR>
<BR>
That's true, but it doesn't count if it wasn't *intended* to be a comedy.<BR>
<g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 08:49:53 GMT<BR>
From: "i Steve" <isteve1967@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller roadshows<BR>
<BR>
>Too right it does, count me in as well. Though being a non-driver, I >may <BR>
>need a lift...<BR>
<BR>
Me too....<BR>
<BR>
>Now... who's going to ref, and which rules...<BR>
<BR>
Well the only Trav I've ever played is the Classic variety...wouln't mind <BR>
having a crack at another incarnation - c'mon, whose going to convert me to <BR>
the New Era...?<BR>
<BR>
iSteve<BR>
______________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 00:49:09 -0800<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: An illustrated Traveller universe<BR>
<BR>
When Jesse says he's going for a better (illustrated) Traveller universe, I<BR>
suspect he's got a similar idea in mind. Countless Beowulfs, Donosevs,<BR>
Xboats and "Puking Dogs" later, everybody knows what these ships look like.<BR>
Who can think of the Aslan without thinking of the fantastic Kieth<BR>
illustrations? Or the Trepida / Intrepid grav tank without thinking of the<BR>
scads of illustrations which brought the vehicle to life?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Not to mention things like the "Starports" cover.  I am fully conscious of<BR>
what I show, and wish that I had other ethnic backgrounds shown, or other<BR>
SPECIES completely.  My best friend Todd (Tascelt here on the list) couldn't<BR>
make the shoot (he's black Portugese), but my good friend Evans Pang did.<BR>
He's of Chinese descent.  In the future, I dearly want to have Todd in some<BR>
of the illos, along with Evans again, and alien species either done as full<BR>
scale special effects makeup or done as composited miniatures.<BR>
<BR>
Later,<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 00:49:09 -0800<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Sac'to? (Was Re: SF Trav game)<BR>
<BR>
Hell, I'm in Milpitas (close enough for a road trip), and Todd's in<BR>
Stockton.  Ya' never know!  You should come out to BayCon next Memorial Day<BR>
weekend.  Seems to be shaping up as a major West Coast TML get together.<BR>
<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Jason T.<BR>
Barnabas<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 1999 2:38 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Sac'to? (Was Re: SF Trav game)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Any chance there might be anyone in Sacramento who<BR>
might be interested in an occasional get together?<BR>
- --<BR>
Jason<BR>
___________________________________________<BR>
    The rules have changed...  Get paid to surf the web.<BR>
http://www.alladvantage.com/home.asp?refid=BMM-972<BR>
Please tell them BMM-972 if they ask who recruited you.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________<BR>
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World<BR>
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at<BR>
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 22 Dec 1999 23:43:34 +0000<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: RE: England<BR>
<BR>
At 18:25 -0500 22/12/99, Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com> wrote:<BR>
>Well, let's not forget the Argentine invasion of the<BR>
>Falkland Islands, which I understand are treated as an<BR>
>integral part of Britain, just like the Orkneys and<BR>
>Channel Islands.<BR>
<BR>
Nope. They are (IIRC) a Dependency which is significantly different <BR>
to the Orkneys, for example. When the Falklands kicked off, the <BR>
Tories were in the process of removing the islander's rights to <BR>
reside in the UK mainland.<BR>
<BR>
>That the invasion was not successful can be credited<BR>
>- -- as usual -- to the United States.  They'd still be<BR>
>speaking Spanish in the Falklands if the United States<BR>
>hadn't violated its treaty obligations to Argentina<BR>
>and its own Monroe Doctrine to supply the British with<BR>
>intelligence in the form of intercepted communications<BR>
>and space imaging.<BR>
<BR>
There speaks a man who never experienced Maggie Thatcher first hand. <BR>
I don't think she would have stopped with or without the US backing. <BR>
:-/<BR>
<BR>
Although the US help was very useful - probably reducing the number <BR>
of deaths involved - however, there was also significant intelligence <BR>
provided by SBS and SAS teams in the area of operations and in South <BR>
America itself.<BR>
<BR>
Chile's support was key, which is one of the reasons being used to <BR>
argue against the extradition of their former leader.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 09:21:42 +0000<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: FGMP<BR>
<BR>
At 20:11 -0500 22/12/99, "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
> >An FGMP does 12d6, right? <g><BR>
><BR>
>Under CT, it is 16d, halved at VL, and quartered at Extreme.<BR>
>The PGMP-14 does 12.<BR>
>Under MT, damage of PGMP's and FGMP's seems to equal the TL. Pen Climbs<BR>
>with TL and switching from Plasma to Fusion.<BR>
><BR>
>No ideas under T4.x/t5/GT. Can't find the<BR>
<BR>
A T4 PCMP-15  does 25D damage plus 6D explosive damage plus potential <BR>
blinding and splash effects.<BR>
<BR>
Nasty.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 09:25:01 +0000<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #1555<BR>
<BR>
At 22:06 -0500 22/12/99, GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> Not really. The _I:E_ rules are sadly lacking in color/fill text. Really<BR>
> playable, tho. The map shows NO boundaries, a few starports, and<BR>
> urbanization re >><BR>
><BR>
>Like I said earlier, don't take the map as gospel to the millimeter.<BR>
<BR>
Loren,<BR>
<BR>
You realise how many canonites this will have put into shock and trauma?<BR>
<BR>
;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1982 20:27:15 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Vargr gait (was Re: In Jokes)<BR>
<BR>
> From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
> Subject: Re: In Jokes<BR>
<BR>
> Note. If you ever try to "walk digigrade" keep in mind that it is *not*<BR>
> done like a human on tip-toe. Instead, both the ankle *and* the knee<BR>
> are kept bent. This keeps the center of gravity over the ground contact<BR>
> points, but results in a *very* different gait. Sort of a "glide". Even<BR>
> without make-up, you look quite non-human.<BR>
<BR>
See John Sayles' movie The Brother From Another Planet.  Two human<BR>
actors make themselves look totally alien simply by changing their gait,<BR>
rhythm, and a few aspects of body language.  It's pretty creepy.  I<BR>
sometimes do it at Halloween, if the costume is right.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1982 20:33:11 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: China (was: United States)<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Jason T. Barnabas" <cybernaut@netzero.net><BR>
<BR>
> There was also an American by the name of James (his<BR>
> first name escapes me just now, it might have been<BR>
> Henry) who built the only profitable trans-continental<BR>
<BR>
Ah, the famous James family:  Henry James the novellist; his brother<BR>
William James the mystic; and their cousin Jesse James the train<BR>
robber.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1982 20:42:07 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: England<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> From: Mark Watson <markw@antares.demon.co.uk><BR>
 <BR>
> On Wed, 22 Dec 1999, Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Well, let's not forget the Argentine invasion of the<BR>
> >Falkland Islands, which I understand are treated as an<BR>
> >integral part of Britain, just like the Orkneys and<BR>
> >Channel Islands.  <BR>
> ><BR>
> You understand wrong. The Falklands are a Dependent Territory with their<BR>
<BR>
Thank you for explaining it clearly.  <BR>
<BR>
> >That the invasion was not successful can be credited<BR>
> >-- as usual -- to the United States.  They'd still be<BR>
> >speaking Spanish in the Falklands if the United States<BR>
> >hadn't violated its treaty obligations to Argentina<BR>
> >and its own Monroe Doctrine to supply the British with<BR>
> >intelligence in the form of intercepted communications<BR>
> >and space imaging.  <BR>
> ><BR>
> I doubt it, though it might have been more difficult to retake the islands.<BR>
> If the US had actively opposed the British action as they did in Suez that<BR>
> would have been a different matter. <BR>
<BR>
I don't think it's much in doubt that active assistance by the United<BR>
States was at least very important to retaking the Falklands, although<BR>
the British probably could have succeeded eventually with just their own<BR>
assets.  That's based on my memory of analysis in the press (U.S.,<BR>
British, French, and the World Marxist Review) at the time and shortly<BR>
after.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1982 20:49:17 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re Subsidies<BR>
<BR>
> From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
<BR>
> As for his "Monopoly", it would probably have made a tidy profit.<BR>
> Monopolies are not technically illegal in the US... they are only illegal<BR>
> when they prevent the rise of competition by unfair buisiness practice. For<BR>
<BR>
Moreover, the issue of legality of monopolies did not even arise until<BR>
the early twentieth century, after they decided to start using the<BR>
Sherman Anti-Trust Act against its actual intended targets, trusts in<BR>
restraint of trade.  Prior to that, the Act was a union-busting tool. <BR>
I've forgotten when the Act became law; it seems to me 1890-something.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
(a typical history major, I can't recall most historical dates)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1982 21:04:19 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: England<BR>
<BR>
> From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
> <BR>
> > >Actually - and this may come as a suprise to Americans - Britain does not have a <BR>
> > >bill of rights,  or even a written constitution. <BR>
> <BR>
> > This is no surprise at all to Americans.  Why do you think we kicked your king and <BR>
> > soldiers out of here two hundred some years ago?  Why did we establish a republic <BR>
> > and not a new monarchy? <BR>
> <BR>
> The reason the US established a republic and not a monarchy is that George Washington <BR>
> said no, or more accurately "NO!!",  when they asked  him to be the King of America. <BR>
<BR>
It wasn't just a personal whim of Washington's to support creating a<BR>
republic and not a monarchy.  He knew what he'd been fighting, and he<BR>
knew what the American people wanted: freedom, specifically and<BR>
especially freedom from European class stratification and all of the<BR>
political and legal abuses of a monarchical system.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1982 21:14:50 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: England<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
 <BR>
> >The last successful invasion of Britain was the German invasion of the<BR>
> >Channel Islands in 1940, which they held for the rest of WWII. <BR>
<BR>
> That's not an invasion of Britain. That's an invasion of a very small part<BR>
> of the country. (Annexation? I never was much good in history...)<BR>
<BR>
If that's a typical attitude, it's no wonder someone (i.e., the USA) has<BR>
had to bail your country out of two major wars in this century.  You<BR>
know, I'm going to chop off your toe -- it's not an attack to you, just<BR>
to a very small part of you.<BR>
<BR>
Annexation, by the way, is something different from, but often preceded<BR>
by, invasion.  Annexation occurs when one country makes another country<BR>
part of itself.  That's how the United States expanded beyond the<BR>
original colonies, through annexation of native lands.  <BR>
Iraq annexed Kuwait in 1990, making it an integral part of Iraq. <BR>
Germany annexed Austria and Czechoslovakia in 1938.  Germany did not<BR>
annex France; it merely invaded and set up a puppet government, but<BR>
France was still France, with its own language and laws. <BR>
<BR>
Ob Traveller:  The Zhodani and Vargr did not intend to annex any<BR>
Imperial territory during the Fifth Frontier War.  The Zhodani wanted to<BR>
stall Imperial expansion to Spinward, and the Vargr wanted loot.  The<BR>
Sworld Worlds (at least in my Traveller Universe, but I'm not sure of<BR>
canon) wanted to re-annex former Sword Worlds previously annexed by the<BR>
Imperium, including Asgard, Saurus, and Tavonni.  The ihatei live to<BR>
annex.  That's what they do.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1982 21:18:29 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Re: USIP<BR>
<BR>
>From: Thad Coons <Sapience@compuserve.com><BR>
<BR>
>With the various kinds of societies, it is difficult to know how<BR>
>societies will interact with one another or respond to social<BR>
>pressures. As a guide to predicting how societies or NPC groups<BR>
>of any kind are likely to behave in social situations, I would<BR>
>like to suggest a Universal Social Interaction Profile (USIP).<BR>
<BR>
This is a very nice idea.  Have you cross-posted it to the Traveller<BR>
Culture Mailing List?  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 10:00:13 +0000<BR>
From: Andy Coombes <coombes@bcs.org.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller roadshows<BR>
<BR>
At 08:49 AM 23/12/1999 GMT, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>Too right it does, count me in as well. Though being a non-driver, I >may <BR>
>>need a lift...<BR>
><BR>
>Me too....<BR>
I do drive. Do we have a date for this event? (I'm away over Christmas and<BR>
the New Year)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 00:01:36 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: England<BR>
<BR>
On 23 Dec 99, at 1:12, Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> And how many wars with the Germans have we lost? (to me, "getting our<BR>
> butts kicked" implies losing...)<BR>
<BR>
Not many. OTOH how many wars have the Germans killed sh*tloads more <BR>
Brits than the Brits killed Germans? Two this century, for starters.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 00:01:36 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: FGMP<BR>
<BR>
On 23 Dec 99, at 3:08, GypsyComet@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> eris@pcola.gulf.net types:<BR>
> <BR>
> >>Under TNE, according to the Mk1 Md1 (Not the rulebook in force when I<BR>
> >>ran the game, that were under a Mk1 Md0). Also shows a pen of 0.5-2-4.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >My TNE shows something like 12-6-3 for FGMP's, is that Mk1 Md0?  If I've<BR>
> >read the rules correctly you're right the FGMP wouldn't penetrate AV 4<BR>
> >Combat Armor...heck, if I read them right AV 1 would stop that FGMP at<BR>
> >short range, right?  So, I *know* those stats must be wrong. <g><BR>
> ><BR>
> >I suppose 1/2-2-4 makes more sense.  The vargr's Combat Armor would soak<BR>
> >up 2 die (so 2 points of blunt trauma) and he's suffer 10d6+2 (12-37-62),<BR>
> >or 6d6+6 (12-27-42) if he was in Battle Dress.  Either way, Mr V.<BR>
> >shouldn't have survived long enough to kick Mr Z.<BR>
<BR>
Even using the later errata (all Plasma and Fusion weapons have a Pen <BR>
of 1-2-10 IIRC) there's no way in hell that that Vargr should've won. <BR>
The minimum damage (assuming AV4) from a DV12 FGMP should've knocked <BR>
him down, and probably given him a slight wound (thus dropping his <BR>
initiative to 5 - no second action), and allowing the Zho another shot, <BR>
with similar result. Not a very impressive way of killing someone with <BR>
a Fusion Gun, but he still should've been dead.<BR>
<BR>
> >TNE'ers out there, am I wrong about this?<BR>
> ><BR>
>  No. You are correct.<BR>
>  The original printing of the TNE rulebook put the High Energy weapon<BR>
> penetration VALUES (ie. for vehicle combat) in the spot it should have<BR>
> listed Penetration RATINGS (used for personal combat). The first clue is<BR>
> that the numbers go the wrong way with range. In personal combat the PEN<BR>
> number rises with range (more points lost per point of armor), but the HE<BR>
> Weapons table has numbers that go down (less armor punched w/range, the<BR>
> vehicle way).<BR>
>  One annoyance: the numbers in FF&Sr1 don't quite agree with the main book<BR>
>  <BR>
> (r0 in this case). FF&S lists Fusion weapons as 0.5-1-4, not 0.5-2-4. I<BR>
> don't have a late edition TNE rulebook to compare to...<BR>
<BR>
I can't recall. Later errata made the Pen the same for Plasma and <BR>
Fusion guns.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 00:01:36 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: United States<BR>
<BR>
On 22 Dec 99, at 23:23, JFZeigler@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 12/22/99 10:08:19 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>
> shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> > This points out a "need" fort SF/Fantasy writers. A "timeline" giving<BR>
> >  prominent cultures at various times for the whole world.<BR>
> <BR>
> Penguin Books has a set of historical atlases which fit the bill.  The one<BR>
> for "ancient history," for example, has about forty maps, each showing<BR>
> exactly the same projection of a region including all of Europe and parts<BR>
> of Africa and Asia.  Each map has boundaries marked on it for all major<BR>
> cultural or national groups in existence at a given point in history. <BR>
> Each map also has a facing page of commentary.<BR>
> <BR>
> Almost like a "flip-book" of history.  Very useful as a first source when<BR>
> you're doing research for a historical or time-travel story.<BR>
<BR>
Most good historical atlases have a timeline in them (he says, then <BR>
checks his two and finds that only one has a timeline).<BR>
<BR>
I've found that a historical altas can be a good source of inspiration <BR>
for all sorts things, especially world building, but also any time you <BR>
need an idea about how geography might effect some sort of movement, <BR>
language spread, etc.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 00:01:36 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: TNE Errata (was Re: In Jokes)<BR>
<BR>
On 23 Dec 99, at 2:04, eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> On 12/23/99 at 02:39 AM,  GypsyComet@aol.com said:<BR>
> <BR>
> >Eris typed:<BR>
> <BR>
> >>>Not to second guess you or anything, but let me get this straight. Two<BR>
> >>>characters in *BD* encountered each other in an *engineering access<BR>
> >>>crawlspace*? And one of them fired an FGMP *several* times?<BR>
> >><BR>
> >>An FGMP does 12d6, right? <g><BR>
> <BR>
> > and causes Blunt Trauma, if memory serves...<BR>
> <BR>
> Yes it does, I looked it up.  It also appears that I need to find the<BR>
> errata for TNE because the pen for the FGMP was listed as 12-6-3, and that<BR>
> didn't make sense.  <BR>
> <BR>
> I believe there was errata in a later issue of Challenge.  Is that the<BR>
> definitive TNE errata?<BR>
<BR>
IIRC Challenge 75 had all the changes from FFS MK1 Modo to Mk1 Mod1. A <BR>
later Challenge and (I think) Striker 2 had an article "Putting the <BR>
Heat Back into Plasma" that is the last word (pretty much literally) on <BR>
Plasma/Fusion guns. Its main effect is to make them cheaper, lighter <BR>
and more powerful at low energies, while cutting their power a bit at <BR>
the high end.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 09:30:36 +0000<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Drawing Program<BR>
<BR>
At 0:47 -0500 23/12/99, Michel Vaillancourt <BR>
<misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca> wrote:<BR>
>        _Campagin Cartographer 2_ and _City Designer 2_ by ProFantasy<BR>
>Software  ( "http://www.profantasy.com").  Check out my websites (see URL's<BR>
>below) for examples of neat things (including deckplans) that you can do<BR>
>with it.  *GREAT* software, better support.<BR>
<BR>
Except on the Mac :-(<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 09:37:15 +0000<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Drawing Program<BR>
<BR>
At 0:47 -0500 23/12/99, "Thomas Vickers" <redroach@flex.net> wrote:<BR>
>If you use a Mac, I have to recommend Claris Works.<BR>
>Amazingly enough, I have used it for floor plans and such and my Fantasy GM<BR>
>uses it<BR>
>to create excellent terrain maps.<BR>
>It isn't too fancy, but it damn well works.<BR>
<BR>
For the newbies to the Mac Scene ClarisWorks is what AppleWorks used <BR>
to be called. And it's a damn fine, stable package. This ships with <BR>
the iMac and iBook (not sure about the G4's) and is about 70 GBP to <BR>
buy otherwise for WINDOWS and MacOS.<BR>
<BR>
Personally, I like Adobe Illustrator but that's out of the price <BR>
range we're considering.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 09:38:27 +0000<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Drawing Program<BR>
<BR>
At 0:47 -0500 23/12/99, "Jim & Peta Lawrie" <jimpeta@primus.com.au>  wrote:<BR>
> >If you use a Mac, I have to recommend Claris Works.<BR>
> <snip><BR>
>   Anything for PC though?<BR>
<BR>
AppleWorks 5, nee ClarisWorks 5. You can get it for the PC too.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1561<BR>
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